tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8939666320943790100.post6998271304150252332..comments2024-02-11T01:14:21.904-08:00Comments on SURVIVING IN ARGENTINA: So You Think You Want a Revolution...FerFALhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07578136334334588454noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8939666320943790100.post-58093436438051502242010-08-28T07:18:16.628-07:002010-08-28T07:18:16.628-07:00"A human being should be able to change a dia..."A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." <br /><br />- Robert HeinleinJ Brownnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8939666320943790100.post-31009499687132413442009-11-12T22:37:57.181-08:002009-11-12T22:37:57.181-08:00Historically, slave revolts in the Caribbean Islan...Historically, slave revolts in the Caribbean Islands happened quite often and were often successful. Just to name one area as an example.<br /><br />I wonder what would protect someone from the effects of tear gas other than gas masks?<br /><br />This guys story reminded me of the movie The Ultimate Warrior with Yul Brenner, especially the part about the crowds throwing concrete blocks to get inside the buildings.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8939666320943790100.post-28519727775809003352009-11-12T20:30:22.659-08:002009-11-12T20:30:22.659-08:00In the english language, the situation described w...In the english language, the situation described would be defined as a 'revolt'. Revolutions are an organized effort to take control of a current government either by force or by political means. Revolts are not effective. aAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8939666320943790100.post-80178369759067474802009-11-12T07:14:25.892-08:002009-11-12T07:14:25.892-08:00d) Ernestina Herrera de Noble, age 84, net worth u...d) Ernestina Herrera de Noble, age 84, net worth unknown<br /><br />d.1) Her fortune is based on ownership of Grupo Clarín, Argentina's largest news media<br />conglomate. (TV, Radio, Newspapers) <br /><br />HOW she acquired Grupo Clarin is interesting:<br />"Ernestina Laura Herrera was born in Argentina, in 1925. She became a<br /> Flamenco dancer and met Clarín publisher Roberto Noble, around 1950.<br />[1] The two maintained a sporadic relationship until Noble and his<br /> wife, Guadalupe Zapata, were divorced in the early 1960s.[2] She and the publisher were married in 1967, and on January 12, 1969, <br />he lost his battle with cancer.<br /><br />As his widow, she inherited a controlling stake in Clarín, <br />Argentina's most-widely circulated newspaper since 1965[1] "<br />Ref: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ernestina_Herrera_de_Noble<br /><br />d.2) According to this Wiki article, <br />Ernestina and Mrs Kirchner don't seem to get along very well:<br /><br />"Mrs. Noble was detained in December 2002 by order of Judge Roberto<br /> Marquevich following a lawsuit filed by the Grandmothers of the Plaza de Mayo alleging that the two infants she adopted in 1976, Felipe and Marcela, should submit DNA samples on the possibility that their biological parents may have been abducted by the last dictatorship during their "Dirty War" against dissidents.[6][7] Her request to deny the samples was ruled in her favor in June 2008, though the case remains in litigation. [8] On October 17, 2009, President Cristina Kirchner proposed the compulsory submission of DNA samples in cases related to crimes against humanity, in a move lauded by the Grandmothers of the Plaza de Mayo, but excoriated by opposition figures as a political move against Mrs. Noble.[9]"<br /><br />"Similar motives are alleged by the opposition against the president's Media Law, which would restrict the number of media licenses per proprietor and allocate a greater share of these to state and NGOs, thereby limiting the influence of the Clarín Group, with which <br />Kirchnerism had recently had a souring of hitherto cordial relations.[10]"<br /><br />e) Paolo Rocca -- age 57, net worth unknown<br /><br />Paolo is the third generation of an Italian family that was close to Mussolini and who immigrated to Argentina in 1946 (hee hee.) <br /><br />Fortune is based on Techint (Massive steel fabricating conglomerate) melded with huge <br />steel manufacturing firm Siderar (Formerly State-owned Somisa , purchased by the Roccas in 1992 during President Carlos Menem's privatization drive.<br />Siderar had about 79 percent of Argentina's steel industry circa 1996)<br />Ref: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roberto_Rocca<br />and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paolo_Rocca<br /><br />NOTE: The second link notes that Christina Kirchner has also annoyed<br />Paolo, by letting Hugo Chavez seize a Venezuela firm in which Paolo had an interest.<br /><br /><br />"The decision of Venezuelan President Hugo Chávez to nationalize Sidor came on the heels of a series of industrial disputes over the previous <br />year.[9] [10] Compensation of around US$1.65 billion was agreed for the nationalisation of Ternium's 60% stake in Sidor, with the former keeping a 10% stake in the company,[11] but frictions emerged with the Kirchner administration in Argentina over their reported refusal to raise objections to the nationalization with President Chávez.[12]<br /><br />The Techint Group, which from 2003 to 2008 had invested US$2.3 billion<br /> in its Argentine operations,[12] responded with Rocca's announcement<br /> that the conglomerate's trade finance operations would be transferrd<br /> to neighboring Uruguay.[13]<br /><br />Rocca was named president of the World Steel Association on October 13, 2009.[14] "<br /><br />NOTE: Rocca has evidently moved <br />the financial management of his firms to Luxembourg -- a notorious supporter of tax evasion -- or , as the Rich call it, "privacy".Don Williamsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8939666320943790100.post-70930370620779528382009-11-12T07:14:04.899-08:002009-11-12T07:14:04.899-08:00(continued)
3) Here is a partial list of Argentina...(continued)<br />3) Here is a partial list of Argentina's Wealthy that I have found at first glance:<br /><br />a) Gregorio Perez Companc --age 74, $1.8 Bil<br />Sold oil/gas firm to Petrobas (Brazil) in 2002,<br />now invested in food processing. Reportedly has donated money to Catholic charities over the years.<br /><br />b) Eduaro Eurnekian -age 76,less than $1 Bil<br />Tv, cable, radio, operates 33 of Argentina's main airports, regional airline LAPA<br />plus 2000 sq km of land in northern Argentina<br /><br />Armenian immigrant, has been diversifying into Armenia agriculture and operation of<br />Armenian airports.<br /><br />c) María Amalia Lacroze de Fortabat - age 88, est $2 Bil net worth<br /><br />Owns roughly 1.7 million acres of land, many valuable Buenos Aires properties, Fortune built on concrete construction firm Loma Negra plus purchase of <br /> 65% in Ferrosur Roca, a state-owned freight and passenger <br />railway that became Loma Negra's in-house transport service when <br />Economy Minister Domingo Cavallo had it privatized in 1992.<br />Grandson Alejandro Bengolea --made director in 2002 --was a disaster, dismissed 2002,<br />Mrs Fortabat sold Loma Negra to Brazilian firm Camargo Correa in 2005 for about<br />$1 Bil<br /><br />Note: Companc, Eurnekian, and Fortabat probably are involved in Argentina's soya production-- which is earning a lot of money in exports but which is causing large scale deforestation in northern Argentina and will likely<br /> ruin the soil there. <br /><br />The Argentinian protests against the Kirchner's proposed tax<br />on soya exports may have been "Astroturf" -- American political slang for political protests that claim to be the voice of the common citizens<br />(the "grassroots") but which are really a false front funded by <br />wealthy plutocrats (hence, the false plastic grass "Astroturf" used in football stadiums)Don Williamsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8939666320943790100.post-75343793832505039452009-11-12T07:13:00.299-08:002009-11-12T07:13:00.299-08:001) In my opinion, political protests are a waste o...1) In my opinion, political protests are a waste of time in repressive regimes --and divert the population from more effective measures which strike at the wealthy plutocrats who run things. <br /><br />Strikes. Industrial sabotage. etc. <br /><br />If the middle class wants a fairer deal from its overlords, then it needs to hit those overlords in their pocketbooks. A sniper does not spray the landscape at an undefined "THEY" -- he knows his targets.<br /><br />2) However, a look at Argentina's wealthy show that they already took measures 8 years ago to insulate themselves from social unrest --although the Kirchners are making some of them uncomfortable.Don Williamsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8939666320943790100.post-5172860485085384922009-11-12T00:17:19.674-08:002009-11-12T00:17:19.674-08:00After reading this post, and then reading FOR WHAT...After reading this post, and then reading FOR WHAT IT’S WORTH<br />http://financialsense.com/editorials/quinn/2009/1111.html<br /><br />I think our two countries are more alike than they are different. Many other countries too. Here's a bit from the Quinn article which discussed revolution, history and the generations that really made me think this, perhaps you'll agree?:<br /><br />"Trust in our government, financial, corporate, media, and religious leaders have never been lower. We are entering Phase 2 of this Crisis period. When the foolish self-serving actions taken by the government in the last year fail to revive our economy and the inevitable stock market crash and deepening depression take hold, Americans will become more disillusioned, angry and looking for someone to hold responsible."<br /><br />It's looking more and more like WWIII is the elite vs. the people. Isn't that what this fellow described how he felt when he experienced the revolution in BA?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8939666320943790100.post-86383952551934133302009-11-11T19:53:02.358-08:002009-11-11T19:53:02.358-08:00Totalinvestor,
those are nice skills but don't...Totalinvestor,<br />those are nice skills but don't fool yourself, they are really of little practical use in areas of serious crime. <br />I know people that avoided being kidnapped, even escaped:<br />1) Drivings skills, just crashed their way through.Most often case.<br />2)A person I know jumped out of the kidnapers car, there's a couple more that did just that. Most got seriously wounded doing so.<br />3) One escaped through the roof, after bending a loose metal sheath. He was locked in a room but not tied.<br />Most cases you're going nowhere, they keep you chained to a bed with a lock, with a guard watching over you. And they only throw you in cars in movies, all kidnaps I heard of, they keep you at gunpoint inside the car where they can keep an eye on you.<br /><br />I suppose a total sheep (like the reporter lady from the linked video) would feel " a little more paranoid". Other than that put your money in the following training:<br />1)Handgun fighting <br />2) Armed and unarmed fighting<br />3) Evasive driving<br />4) First Aid/Medical emergency <br /><br />All of the above are MUCH better ways of spending your money.<br /><br />FerFALFerFALhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07578136334334588454noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8939666320943790100.post-60973642085791798412009-11-11T19:04:20.495-08:002009-11-11T19:04:20.495-08:001) I am not very knowledgeable re Argentina, but ...1) I am not very knowledgeable re Argentina, but my understanding is that it was the military junta of 1973-1983 (El Proceso) that really sunk Argentina deeply into foreign debt -- from which Raul Alfonsin was not able to recover.<br /><br />Carlos Menem's "privatization" apparently added to the damage.<br /><br />2) Anybody want to guess who taught the generals of El Proceso how to "spread democracy"? heh heh<br /><br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_of_the_Americas#Graduates_of_the_School_Of_The_Americas<br /><br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Reorganization_Process#Attitude_of_the_United_StatesDon Williamsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8939666320943790100.post-6394915867237923732009-11-11T18:35:03.169-08:002009-11-11T18:35:03.169-08:00Here is a link to an article about "survival ...Here is a link to an article about "survival school"<br /><br />http://www.thebigmoney.com/articles/experience/2009/07/16/survival-school?page=fullTotalinvestorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08795504345874676293noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8939666320943790100.post-55385448941183322322009-11-11T10:11:52.189-08:002009-11-11T10:11:52.189-08:00That was an incredible article and first hand acco...That was an incredible article and first hand account. The author is a remarkable witness to history.<br /><br />History repeats itself.BulgarWheatnoreply@blogger.com