Thursday, October 4, 2012

Telescopic Baton Recommendation?

Hi Ferfal
Could you recommend a good collapsible/telescopic baton and an online place to buy one? I live in Europe
Thanks
Nic

Hi Nic, telescopic batons are one of the defensive tools I’ve seen catastrophically fail the most, both using it myself and in the hands of others.
The cheap ones? Absolute garbage. The somewhat more expensive ones? Garbage that lasts a couple days more at most.
The only telescopic baton I would recommend is the ASP. If you cant afford an ASP just got for a regular stick or tonfa. Again, just don’t buy the cheaper collapsible batons, they break on deployment alone, hit someone with one and it will come apart at the worst possible moment.
I prefer edged weapons myself but especially in Europe where laws vary a lot from one country to another a telescopic baton may be a good option if you can carry one legally. Again, check your local laws and carry the best defensive tool you can.
Can you break someone’s arm (or skull) with one of these? Oh yes, you can, and if firearms aren’t of frequent use by criminals in your location one of these would be adequate to deal with most aggressors.
Asp Law Enforcement F21FA Foam Airweight Fricton Loc Baton (21-Inch)
Asp Law Enforcement F21FA Foam Airweight Fricton Loc Baton (21-Inch)
Remember to at least take a couple baton classes so as to learn its proper use. The telescopic baton is pretty versatile and can be used both for strikes, blocking, armlocks and locks to the neck, in addition to its use as a kubotan in its collapsed form.
About the place to buy, clicking on the picture or link above takes you to Amazon where the ASP is for sale for a good price. You may or may not find it available for sale from Amazon depending on your country of origin.
FerFAL

14 comments:

Refuse/Resist! said...

As far as I know there are some other quality batons around as well.
In Europe, the czech ESP is quite good and costs half the price of ASPs, the hardened version is said to be stronger than the normal ASP.

hsu said...

You are better off buying an "Unbreakable Umbrella".

http://real-self-defense.com/unbreakable-umbrella/

It's about the same price as the ASP baton, but nobody will think of it as a weapon, which means that you can take it anywhere and everywhere.

Anonymous said...

Fernando, I know Nic specifically asked about collapsible batons and with your distaste for them I'm surprised you didn't make another suggestion. The lowly, tactical flashlight. They are THE best carry self defense tool aside from a handgun. Some people prefer knives (such as yourself) and they are certainly handy to have and very dangerous in the hands of someone trained and experienced. But I will take my little 200 lumen tactical over anything but a handgun. They are a "semi bladed" weapon (with the scalloped bezel). They can also be used as a kebotan AND it does not require you be in striking distance to be effective (temporarily blind). Hit them with the beam and even in daylight, you get a good three seconds at least to fight or flight. If you choose to fight you DEFINITElY have an advantage. I have some training in hand to hand and I practice with my little tactical regularly (striking a cardboard covered heavy bag) and also in hitting the target with a beam. You also cannot be charged with "assault with a deadly weapon" should you use one (as opposed to a knife or a baton).As you can tell I am a REAL BIG fan of tactical flashlights. And that love is certainly not misplaced. There are very reasonable deals at Amazon for 200 lumen CREE tacticals (Techlite LumenMaster). Get one, you won't regret it.

FerFAL said...

Hi! excellent point on the tactical flashlight. Yes, it cna be very hadny if you have a powerful one with a strike bezel, mine is 1000 lumen beast for home defense. I'm looking for a new one for EDC with a striek bezel of some sort. What are you carrying and using for practice?
FerFAL

Anonymous said...

There was a case of a person dying due to a torches strike bezel penetrating their skull and getting to their brain.

So nice to know.

Anonymous said...

Good post.

My mother carries a telescopic baton when walking her dog, since it was once attacked suddenly by two larger dogs. She had to extend the baton once for some reason and discovered its biggest problem: it was very, very difficult to collapse. My father had to use a heavy vise just to shorten it again.

Anonymous said...

Ferfal-

As usual, a KICK A$$ response. Thanks for your dedication to this blog and for being so generous with your hard-earned knowledge.
Next - Thank you to both Anonymous and Hsu - the umbrella and flashlight ideas are KILLER. Here's why:
Last year Ferfal gave a great interview regarding what crime will be like here in the USA, once the economy gets really ugly.
As a civilian who is licensed to carry a firearm, I am constantly vigiliant, and my body language conveys this. I always have a gun and my head is on a swivel - I'm
always looking for trouble. Frankly I have never had a problem with crime. My wife and kids are a very different matter. Additionally, my wife will NEVER carry a weapon on her person.

But an umbrealla, or a flashlight? She already carries both of these. Additionally, my children can openly carry these items as well.
And as crime gets worse and worse, I can present the option of attending a few training classes, which she may be open to, and which my children will definitely
attend. Great suggestons and great post - Thanks Guys!
---------------------------
BTW - Here is theFerfal interview:
http://www.shtfplan.com/emergency-preparedness/preparing-for-economic-collapse_05172011

Scroll down to "Step#4 - Improving Your Personal and Home Security" to find one of the BEST quotes of the article:

"Crime and insecurity will be one of the greatest threats people all across USA will suffer, and very few will be ready for it. It won’t happen one dark gloomy night
after watching the latest horror movie. It will happen in the Walmart parking lot at 3 pm, with plenty of people around (people who will hurry out of the way,
pretending not to see anything). You’ll be thinking about what you just bought, that you maybe should have bought Lucky Charms instead of Corn Flakes. That’s when the nice-looking person with two other buddies, all well-dressed (with neat hair cuts, too), pulls a gun on you. Developing a sense of awareness will be the most important part, as well as making the rest of your family comprehend that times have changed and you can no longer be careless regarding security"

CapnRick said...

I agree that extendable batons don't hold up. Herez what I went back to... police have used slap jacks/black jacks for years. Basically, a leather sock with shotgun lead shot n a spring handle in it, hides easily in any pocket, and is unequalled in performance, especially one vs many situations. You perform a successful cartoid shock hit, head hit or clavicle hit, n the other guy has suddenly developed priorities other than bugging you.

I am not the only one who thinks they are effective: they are illegal to carry in some places.

What could be more deliable n durable as a carry weapon than this?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slapjack_(weapon)

http://www.weapons-universe.com/Personal_Defense/Leather_Billy_Clubs.shtml

CapnRick said...

I agree that extendable batons don't hold up. Herez what I went back to... police have used slap jacks/black jacks for years. Basically, a leather sock with shotgun lead shot n a spring handle in it, hides easily in any pocket, and is unequalled in performance, especially one vs many situations. You perform a successful cartoid shock hit, head hit or clavicle hit, n the other guy has suddenly developed priorities other than bugging you.

I am not the only one who thinks they are effective: they are illegal to carry in some places.

What could be more deliable n durable as a carry weapon than this?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slapjack_(weapon)

http://www.weapons-universe.com/Personal_Defense/Leather_Billy_Clubs.shtml

Anonymous said...

Hey Fernando,
Thanks for response and asking for suggestions. I carry a Techlite Lumen Master 200 lumen. I have a Surefire E2DL but that is for the wife. We both practice with what we carry. Techlite: Good - it takes regular AAA (I have rechargables and a charger). Bad - the first setting isn't its brightest setting (but still bright enough). The Surefire is better in every way except the batteries (they are more expensive and not as common as AAA). Both are well built and the Techlite CANNOT be beat for the price. If I could design a light though, I would make the setting be selected by a sliding switch separate from the on/off button with the on/off button being just that. No cycling through modes. You set the mode you want and when you turn it on, BOOM, it's the setting you want. On/off. Blinding brightness, then dark.

We practice with the flashlights once a week on a heavy bag wrapped in a few layers of cardboard. I also have taught my wife 5 various coordinated fighting moves in addition to: 5 strikes (heel palm, hammer, front elbow, back elbow and backfist), 2 kicks (front snap, side kick; nothing where the body tilt is more than 45 degree angle), 2 stomps (front and back), 2 common wristlocks, and 2 pressure point/holds using the flashlight as a kebotan. We practice the strikes and kicks several times a week on the heavy bag as a cardio workout. The holds and locks we practice one about 10 times after every cardio session and cycle through to the next one the next session. I have also taught her to head butt and eye gouge but for obvious reasons we don't practice those. What I have taught her is actually more than necessary but it's pretty well rounded. Anything more is overkill. Best to keep it simple and not go overboard. As the great Bruce Lee once said, "I don't fear a man who can throw 10,000 punches as much as I fear the man who has thrown 1 punch 10,000 times."

Anyone wanting to learn some moves, holds, locks or pressure points can do so just from You Tube. You just need someone to practice with. Knowing the move isn't enough, you actually have to practice it.

to be cont.

Anonymous said...

Cont.

When I'm feeling brave, we put on the pads I still have from my martial arts days and I let her practice fighting me off. It's hard because I know her moves but I try to fight like I don't. Unless someone has a decent amount of training they are in for a humbling experience should they press her into action. She's not the most powerful puncher but an effective punch doesn't need to be a mule kick. She does all this because if she didn't, she knows I wouldn't stop bugging her about it. Plus, what wife wouldn't like to deck her husband on occassion?

About me. I comment here on occassion (always as Anonymous). I'll refer to myself as Senor Fiesta from here on out. My hand to hand training was in no specific style, just some dude who was starting a dojo in the L.A. area back in the late 80's. He was a military brat who spent time growing up in Korea and the Phillipines. He had a couple of wrestling trophies and two Thai boxing trophies. He called what he taught "Tactical Self Defense." It was a mix of everything and his training methods were VERY hands on (physical fitness and sparring, sparring, sparring). I'm not what I would call a prepper. I would like to be a little more prepared than we are but I can't get my wife to "buy in" for anything more than two weeks worth of supplies (we are on a tight budget). I do not have an EDC with lighters, compass, multi-tool, etc. I do not have a BOB or a GHB although I am working on a GHB. I currently do not own a gun but it is a goal (working on her for that one). My brother used to have a fine collection of handguns and rifles so I have handled and shot guns in the past and used to be a decent shot with a handgun, not so much with rifles (I really loved his garand although I sucked with it).

I love your site. Keep talking common sense instead of some of the insane crap on some survivalist/prepper sites.

CapnRick said...

I agree that extendable batons don't hold up. Herez what I went back to... police have used slap jacks/black jacks for years. Basically, a leather sock with shotgun lead shot n a spring handle in it, hides easily in any pocket, and is unequalled in performance, especially one vs many situations. You perform a successful cartoid shock hit, head hit or clavicle hit, n the other guy has suddenly developed priorities other than bugging you.

I am not the only one who thinks they are effective: they are illegal to carry in some places.

What could be more deliable n durable as a carry weapon than this?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slapjack_(weapon)

http://www.weapons-universe.com/Personal_Defense/Leather_Billy_Clubs.shtml

Anonymous said...

Hey Fernando, Senor Fiesta here again. I am responding to the Anonymous who mentioned something for his wife and kids to carry. For the kids, a lot of teens today use caribiner clips to hold their keys and attach to their belt loops (mine does). I suggest they get a heavy duty climbing quality one which they can use "brass knuckles" style. Slip your fingers through with the clip side in your palm and you have a straight metal rod over your fist. However, I don't suggest punching like that (although you could). Best to do a hammer strike to the head, clavicle, ribs or hands. Again, not a lethal weapon (although pretty effective) and I've never seen any place make them take it off.

Chuck Haggard said...

The Monadnock batons, specifically the style with the "power safety tip" are a MUCH better choice than any of the ASP batons, both in quality and in effectivness.